We'll give them our money, and they will invest for us in some property, and we'll build some houses on that property, and we'll sell the houses, and we'll all get some returns. And that's the way they built themselves up. Now, of course, they were fitting themselves into the acquisitive society in this way. They weren't thinking as democratic socialists, so to speak, or anarchists. But it's interesting to go back and look at the writings of people like Gustav Landauer and others in the late 19th and early 20th century, who were actually forming cells of political action, political power, economic action and power, and so on, quite outside the system.

[01:15]

And their theory was that we build this up and have more and more cells and network and network, and then the system collapses. That's their idea. And, you know, the whole principle of base communities in Latin America and in Spain and Portugal and Italy and in the Philippines are this kind of NGO principle, non-government organization principle. And they're looking ahead in a general way, but right now they see the need for a credit union or for a market. And so they do it. Probably we're not poor enough, you know, to be motivated to do this. It's only the dirt poor that have to scrabble and do it themselves.

[02:21]

Well, I'm rambling. How am I doing? Back to Buddhism, anybody? Yes. I'm here to talk about right livelihood and thinking about it. And for many people, it's very difficult to think about right livelihood in the context of eating vegetables or eating in restaurants. Excuse me, could you speak just a little louder? Yeah, I'm thinking about right livelihood in the context of just needing to get a job that makes money. Exactly, exactly. Everybody has to draw the line in their own way.

[03:32]

You have yourself to support. You have your family to support. So where do you get a job? And if you find yourself working for a benighted kind of corporation demanding benighted kinds of conduct on your part, what do you do? When I was in college, I was very much interested in the labor movement. And a well-known labor organizer from the mainland came to Hawaii and spoke to our club. And so he and I got well acquainted, and we talked about this very matter, although at that time I was not interested in Buddhism.

[04:43]

Right livelihood was very much on my mind. And he just said, well, at some point you decide to get off the bus. Well, where is that point? I can't say, you know. Even in the most benighted corporation, there is likely to be some aspect of service. So long as you can feel comfortable with that aspect, you are likely to want to stay where you are. At some point, perhaps, there will be a time when you need to get off the bus and find something more conducive to your principles.

[05:57]

Now, there is a bigger problem, you know. I wonder today if the Buddha would not be storming the halls of power, condemning the broad kind of violation of right livelihood. That imposes a stultifying kind of career on millions of people. The system stinks, you know. I think he might say something like that in a more genteel way.

[07:04]

Listening to public radio the other day on my way back from a prison visitation, I heard an author talk about his book. Maybe you know the book. I don't remember the title. It is an autoworker's story. A second generation autoworker. Pardon? Yes. Yes. It was very moving to hear him tell about how utterly destructive of the human psyche, of his own psyche and of his father's psyche, that rote work was, that strenuous rote work was for himself, for his father, and for all the workers.

[08:21]

And this is by no means something that is confined to the auto industry. So that's the other side of wrong livelihood. Yes. I have heard that in Buddhism, suffering is the result of the inability to become free from some sort of attachment. Yeah. Following that line of thought, we suffer when we are ill. Yeah. Is illness also related to attachment? No. You know, illness is simply a function of being a human being. Isan Dorsey, you know, the founder and head of the Hartford Street Zen Do,

[09:31]

which turned into a hospice for people with AIDS, himself got the disease. And I saw a video about the hospice in which he appeared, and he said, to have AIDS is to be alive. A very moving kind of statement. I am very much interested in the rectification of names, rectification of words. This is a Confucian imperative, not a Buddhist imperative. It's one of the tenets of Confucianism, to get the words right. And suffering is one of the really problematic terms found,

[10:37]

not only in Buddhism, but in our society generally. Look up the word suffering in the dictionary, and you'll find it means endure. To allow, to permit, in the King James language, suffer the little children to come unto me, you know. It's very interesting to see that the word dukkha, which is commonly translated as suffering, is translated into German as angst, which is related to our word anxiety or anguish. Now, some of the translators try to render it unsatisfactoriness, which I find very unsatisfactory.

[11:41]

I like anguish there, and I'm trying to persuade my colleagues to use that word instead of suffering, because suffering is so ambiguous. Indeed, in the dictionary, the second meaning is to experience pain. But you have those two meanings. When you suffer illness, you endure illness, and you feel pain. Both. So let's be clear about this. The Buddha said dukkha is everywhere. I would translate that anguish is everywhere. And we are in anguish, because we are not really reconciled to the fact that we're going to die. We're not really reconciled to the fact that nothing abides. No life, no structure, no form, no nothing.

[12:47]

We haven't accepted that, and so we are miserable one way or another. And it's so common for me as a teacher to meet a student in a personal interview who says, I'm afraid. When I do zazen, I find this fear coming. So I will say, what do you suppose is the source of that fear? And sometimes the student will be able to say, I'm afraid of death. Even when they're not able to say it, there is some inkling there,

[13:51]

and eventually they will be able to say it. So the Four Noble Truths to which you allude, you see, are the Buddha's words that dukkha, or anguish, is everywhere. The source of that anger lies in our attachments and desires. Well, there again, we need to be completely clear. I remember one of the teachers we had living with us in the old Maoizendo from Japan, and this was during the New Age, the old New Age, you know. And one day in the dojo, he exploded.

[14:57]

He said, non-attachment, non-attachment, all I hear is non-attachment. If you weren't attached, you'd be dead. Non-attachment. Of course we need our food, we need our affection, well, the rest of it, you see. We have these needs. But, you know, it's a preoccupation with needs that is the source of anguish. And where does that preoccupation come from? But with the unconscious feeling that nothing abides. And we want to put that feeling aside and prove it to be untrue, you see. And so we build our empires, large and small. And then there is the third truth,

[16:03]

which is there is a release from this dukkha, from this anguish. This is a very interesting point. One of my old friends, Mr. Naramoto, was the president of the community association where I was executive secretary in my first job after I graduated from college. And he was a kind of lifetime friend. He helped me a lot in my new job. And then, in his capacity as an insurance agent, he was our insurance man for a good part of our life. And one day he had a terrible heart attack and almost died.

[17:06]

And he was transformed by this experience. An open, generous, kind man became a saint. Really. Everybody commented on it. His face glowed, you know. He lived only eight months after that and had another heart attack and died. Well, I think the Buddha's point is there is such a release from anguish. But we shouldn't be waiting around for some accident like this, you know, for a heart attack. And so the fourth point is his Eightfold Path. And the Eightfold Path are his points of practice. Right views. The views that all things are transient,

[18:11]

we are here only temporarily, and let's look after each other. Right speech. And they're all based on right views, you see. Right speech, right conduct, right livelihood, right effort, right recollection. I may be skipping some, excuse me. Right recollection is rather one of my weak points. Anyway. And then right meditation. And this is the Buddha's Eightfold Path, which is perennial. It's for all people of all religions and all people without religion, you know. It's just as relevant today as when he uttered the words.

[19:17]

So, this is a rather extended answer to your question about suffering. Okay? With this Eightfold Path, we are practicing the release from anxiety in our devotion to our task and our openness to the world. These are the two things. It's very interesting that in Zen practice, I think I mentioned it in the paper, in Zen practice, when you are completely focused, you are also completely open. But when your mind is filled with thoughts, nothing penetrates. Years ago, Anne and I took care of a young woman who was chronically ill with schizophrenia. And she was in and out of the hospital.

[20:22]

And when she'd come out of the hospital, she'd live with us, and then she'd have to go back. And when she was out of the hospital, she attended the University of Hawaii. And one day, I was walking down toward the university, which is very near, and I saw her at a distance walking toward me. And in that part of Manoa Valley, there are no sidewalks. And the hedges of the property are fairly close to the road. So there's just a little grassy space where we walk along. And I watched her as she walked toward me, and I was walking toward her. And we came abreast, and she wasn't looking at anybody. She was just completely lost. And she had this rather wild look in her face. And so I said as quietly as I could, as we passed each other, Hi. And she just jumped out of her skin. She was so startled and so frightened

[21:26]

because she was in another world. She was completely closed off. So that is a kind of extreme example of how we, all of us, get absorbed in our own thing, you know, and we don't hear the other person or the other animal or the other bird or whatever. How are we doing? Hey, some people have left already. We'll have a few more questions. Okay. I'm going to use the microphone so I don't have to yell. If it's on, can you hear me? I sure can. Well, I wish I knew what that was there for. I should have asked everybody to come up. Sorry. I've been thinking that, at least in the West, this may sound foolish, but the practice of Zazen,

[22:29]

sitting meditation, seems to make Zen into more of a hobby rather than a way of life, being as that people are only practicing meditation when sitting. And I was thinking, in a group setting, wouldn't it be more productive rather than just to practice sitting meditation to practice working meditation, walking, writing, jumping, running, doing all forms of meditation. So rather than practice Zen only when sitting, you could practice it in all walks of life. I just wondered what you had to say about that. Right on. You know, well, the serious problems that you have heard about in Western Zen centers, exploitation of students by the teachers, which is not confined to this country,

[23:30]

are a direct outcome of this attitude that Zen is a kind of hobby. And it's the dark side of many Zen institutions. And it is the dark side of the practice of many individuals. To prevent this attitude from governing the practice, work and walking and an occasional party have been a part of monastic Zen

[24:36]

from the very beginning. Eating together, cleaning the temple together, working in the garden together, and so on. And the periods of Zazen, of course, are interspersed with periods of walking, formal walking called Qinyin. So the old teachers knew what they were about and they built these applications, not applications so much, but other kinds of meditation practice into temple life. And we do it too. At the Diamond Sangha in Hawaii, we are building a new temple. Our present temple is too small. And so we bought land and with our own labor,

[25:39]

without anybody else's help at all, from the designing to the construction to even the things that are supposed to be done by the professionals, the master plumbers and the master electricians. We're doing it and we have little ways of getting the signatures on the papers. We're doing everything. And we have construction going on all year round for the residents. But in particular, during the summer, we have two training periods of six weeks each with a session or retreat in between. And the participants in those training periods receive free board and room and session expense. All they have to do

[26:39]

is pay their flight over and they work at building the temple. And of course, our local members join in. And our work leader is a marvelous Zen teacher. He takes trumpet players and secretaries and bookkeepers and whatnot and turns them into carpenters in very short order. And they are mindful as they build. There's very little talking. And we are not using, you know, pneumatic nail drivers or any of those things. We're not using, we are using electric saws, but everything is done very carefully and by hand as much as possible.

[27:39]

And we're in the fourth year of this project. So please come join us. Yes. Okay. Yeah. Sure. Now that we know it's there. I come from this question that the gentleman previous asked from the opposite direction. I'd like to break the engagement with engaged Buddhism. And there's always an excuse not to meditate, not to practice. There always has been. And it seems to me that what you have to offer and what other Zen teachers have to offer is a practice in a way. And that that jewel

[28:42]

that you have to offer is Zazen. Yes. Zazen. Zazen, yes. And that that's more important than being a carpenter or being a trumpet player. You know, like that the seed of Zazen is the seed of enlightenment. All right. And the practice of engaged Buddhism and the thrust to bring our practice into daily life I see as an excuse used over and over again to push us off our cushions. And I'd appreciate your comment on that. Yeah. Okay. This is a very important point. We tend to find excuses not only with engaged Buddhism but also the fact that the dishes are sitting in the sink

[29:43]

and the baby needs to be changed and so on. There are many, many, many reasons not to do Zazen. I know them all. Yes. But you know our dojo, you know and that word dojo is a translation of Bodhimanda which is the place of enlightenment under the Bodhi tree. Our dojo is first of all this body. You know. And it is this cushion and it is this room and in old days it is this monastery.

[30:43]

That's it. The traditional Buddhists in the old countries regarded the outside world as polluted and beyond redemption. If necessary, the master would make friends with the emperor or with the shogun and make it possible to have a better or bigger monastery or to exert influence so that Buddhism would have a more secure place in the community and society. But there in the monastery

[31:52]

the monks were reciting their vows every day to save the many beings. A vow that preceded. Now Buddhism comes to this country and we find ourselves for the most part lay students of Zen or even if we are ordained the chances are that we are married and have a family. You know. And need to find a way to support our family and so on. The walls are down. There aren't any more walls. The monastery walls are coterminous with the universe. And so the walking meditation and the working meditation which classically just maintained the monastery

[32:54]

or provided exercise or a kind of space between, say, Zazen and free time. Suddenly it all becomes practice. I personally can't feel comfortable just sitting on my okoli as we say in Hawaii when I know that not far away there are people without any cushion. You know. And so I have to find and so we have a program of cooking for the homeless. You know. And they are our brothers and sisters. They are part of the Sangha.

[33:54]

They are not separate from us really. So it really boils down to a question of proportion. That I must sit enough to keep myself sane and to keep myself in a condition where I can see into reality more and more clearly. But I must not be so exclusive that I shut out the world. So really what we are facing here is a new kind of Mahayana. You know. Mahayana is the great vehicle. And the development of the great vehicle represents a shift from classical Buddhism to a Buddhism that includes everybody. But with that shift

[34:58]

which occurred two thousand years ago, you know, it was only a shift on paper really. In ideology. In practical ways. So called Mahayana countries today, like say Japan or Korea, are really less Buddhist than the old countries like Sri Lanka. It's quite interesting. So I see a kind of new Mahayana coming where we all of us take responsibility as best we can in our own corner for the whole world. With Zazen, the inspiration for that work. Not all Western Zen teachers

[36:04]

agree with me on this point. Shall we call it a day? Okay. One more. Yes? Do you have any words for the child who is recovering from being violated by an adult? I really would defer to John here, who is not only a Zen teacher but also a psychotherapist. So since I'm sitting here, I can only give kind of rule of thumb or generalized observation that a child who is abused by an adult,

[37:16]

sexually abused by an adult or violated in some other extreme way, has suffered the ultimate kind of bad break. And unless that child is nurtured nurtured in particular ways, unless there is real compassionate intervention in that child's life, there's no hope. Or very little hope. I think that...

[38:20]

Well, I know that the inmates that I meet are men who have been violated in such ways. And I'm sure that mental hospitals are full of such people. Now, by way of hope, I am acquainted with a woman who is a Vipassana teacher who suffered such violation when she was young. And she first took up meditation and this allowed her to settle into a kind of first floor peace,

[39:25]

first floor coherence, first floor satisfaction with herself. And then she went into psychotherapy to deal with the basement, you know, all the rats and the nasty things that were down there in her unconscious. And then she returned to Vipassana meditation and she today is purified. She's maybe early forties and is a radiant personality. But somehow by her good karma she was able to, as an adult, to take herself in hand. But when I said no hope,

[40:30]

here's an exception. I think that somehow in the latter part of her childhood there must have been some sort, I don't know the details, some sort of intervention, some sort of help for her. Or perhaps by the nature of the violation it was such that she could handle it by her own innate strength she could help herself. But I'm thinking more and more that my words of no hope are too extreme. It is possible, as we can see by this example, but it is surely very difficult. And the child is a child and the child is going to need constant work, I think, if the violation went on for extended periods. In the case of my friend it went on for several years.

[41:31]

So I would encourage you if you have influence in such a case or in cases like that to run, do not walk, to your nearest therapist for help. Does this address you? Yes, thank you. Yes, good. Okay. All right. Thank you very much for your wonderful participation. I've enjoyed this therapy. Thank you.

[42:15]

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