Let's say our names, Linda, Theresa, Ida, Chad, Wendy, Laura, Matt, Gary, Michael, Susan, Martha, Sarah, Vignesh, Lisa, Linda, Gwen, Matt, Lee, Erin, Leah, Charlie, Barbara, Krista, Gregory, Jill, Joelle, Dennis, Diana, Liz. And we have some visitors tonight, some guest students and guest retreatants are here. So welcome to the class of six. And we have two people who are going to recite tonight, yes? Sarah and Mia, right? Do one of you want to go first? Sarah, okay. Oh, before you begin, are there extra copies that could be given out to...

[01:17]

So for those of you for whom this is your first class, we're studying the Universal Recommended Instructions for Zazen, or Fukan Zazengi, written by Dogen Zenji. Okay. Fukan Zazengi The way is originally perfect and all-pervading How could it be contingent on practice and realization The true vehicle is self-sufficient What need is there for special effort Indeed the whole body is free from dust Who could believe in a means to brush it clean It is never apart from this very place

[02:22]

What is the use of traveling around to practice And yet if there is a hair's breadth deviation It is like the gap between heaven and earth If the least like or dislike arises The mind is lost in confusion Suppose you are confident in your understanding And rich in enlightenment Gaining the wisdom that knows at a glance Attaining the way and clarifying the mind Arousing arouse an aspiration to reach for the heavens You are playing in the entranceway But you still are short of the vital path of emancipation Consider the Buddha, although he was wise at birth The traces of his six years of upright sitting can yet be seen As for Bodhidharma, although he had received the mind seal His nine years of facing a wall is celebrated still If even the ancient sages were like this How can we today dispense with wholehearted practice Therefore put aside the intellectual practice Of investigating words and chasing phrases And learn to take the backward step

[03:24]

That turns the light and shines it inward Body and mind in themselves will drop away And your original face will manifest If you want such a thing Get to work on such a thing immediately For practicing Zen a quiet room is suitable Eat and drink moderately Put aside all involvements and suspend all affairs Do not think good or bad Do not judge true or false Give up the operations of mind, intellect and consciousness Stop measuring with thoughts, ideas and views Have no designs on becoming a Buddha How could this be limited to sitting or lying down At your sitting place Spread out a thick mat and put a cushion on it Sit either in the full lotus or half lotus position In the full lotus position First place your right foot on your left thigh Then your left foot on your right thigh In the half lotus simply place your left foot on your right thigh Tie your ropes loosely and arrange them neatly Then place your right hand on your left leg

[04:24]

And your left hand on your right palm Thumb tips lightly touching Straighten your body and sit upright Leaning neither left nor right Neither forward nor backward Align your ears with your shoulders And your nose with your navel Rest the tip of your tongue Against the front of the roof of your mouth With teeth and lips together both shut Always keep your eyes open And breathe softly through your nose Once you have adjusted your posture Take a breath and exhale fully Rock your body right and left And settle into steady and movable sitting Think of not thinking Not thinking, what kind of thinking is that? Non-thinking, this is the essential art of Zazen The Zazen I speak of is not meditation practice It is simply the Dharma gate of joyful ease The practice realization of totally culminated enlightenment It is the koan realized Traps and snares can never reach it If you grasp the point You are like a dragon gaining the water Like a tiger taking to the mountains For you must know that the true Dharma Appears of itself

[05:26]

So that from the start Dullness and distraction are struck aside When you arise from sitting Move slowly and quietly Calmly and deliberately Do not rise suddenly or abruptly In surveying the past We find that transcendence Of both mundane and sacred and dying While either sitting or standing Have all depended entirely on the power of Zazen In addition, triggering awakening With a finger, a band or a needle Or a mallet or effecting realization With a whisk, a fist, a staff or a shout These cannot be understood by discriminative thinking Much less can they be known Through the practice of supernatural power They must represent conduct beyond seeing and hearing Are they not a standard prior to knowledge and views? This being the case Intelligence or lack of it is not an issue Make no distinction between the dull and the sharp-witted If you concentrate your efforts single-mindedly That in itself is wholeheartedly engaging the way Practice realization is naturally undefiled Going forward is after all an everyday affair

[06:28]

In general, in our world and others In both India and China All equally hold the Buddha seal While each lineage expresses its own style They are all simply devoted to sitting Totally blocked in resolute stability Although they say that there are ten thousand distinctions And a thousand variations They just wholeheartedly engage the way in Zazen Why leave behind the seed in your own home To wander in vain through the dusty realms of other lands? If you make one misstep You stumble past what is directly in front of you You have gained the pivotal opportunity of human form Do not pass your days and nights in vain You have taken care of the essential activity of the Buddha way Who would take wasteful delight in the spark from a flintstone? Besides, form and substance are like the dew on the grass The fortunes of life, like a dart of lightning Emptied in an instant, vanished in a flash Please, honored followers of Zen Long accustomed to groping for the elephant

[07:28]

Do not doubt the true dragon Devote your energies to the way That points directly to the real thing Revere the one who has gone beyond learning And is free from effort Accord with the enlightenment of all the Buddhas Succeed to the samadhi of all the ancestors Continue to live in such a way And you will be such a person The treasure store will open of itself And you may enjoy it freely Thank you Yeah When you come to Zen The way is originally perfect and all-pervading How could it be contingent on practice and realization? The true vehicle is self-sufficient What need is there for special effort? Indeed, the whole body is free from dust Who could believe in a means to brush it clean? It is never apart from this very place

[08:30]

What is the use of traveling around to practice? And yet if there is a hair's breadth deviation It is like the gap between heaven and earth If the least like or dislike arises The mind is lost in confusion Suppose you are confident in your understanding Enriched in enlightenment Gaining the wisdom that knows at a glance Attaining the way and clarifying the mind Arousing an aspiration to reach for the heavens You are playing in the entranceway But you still are short of the vital path of emancipation Consider the Buddha, although he was wise at birth The traces of the six years of upright staying can yet be seen As for Bodhidharma, although he had received the mind seal His nine years of facing a wall are celebrated still If even the ancient sages were like this How can we today dispense with wholehearted practice? Therefore, put aside the intellectual practice

[09:30]

Of investigating words and chasing phrases And learn to take the backward step That turns the light and shines it inward Body and mind in themselves will drop away And your original face will manifest If you want such a thing, get to work on such a thing immediately For practicing, then, a quiet room is suitable Eat and drink moderately Put aside all involvements and suspend all affairs Do not think good or bad Do not judge true or false Give up the operations of mind, intellect, and consciousness Stop measuring with thoughts, ideas, and views Have no designs on becoming a Buddha How could that be limited to sitting or lying down? At your sitting place, spread out a thick mat and put a cushion on it Sit either in the full lotus or half lotus position In the full lotus position, first place your right foot on your left thigh Then your left foot on your right thigh In the half lotus, simply place your left foot on your right thigh

[10:32]

Tie your ropes loosely and arrange them neatly Then place your right hand on your left leg And your left hand on your right palm, thumb tips slightly touching Straighten your body and sit upright Leaning neither left nor right, neither forward nor backward Align your ears with your shoulders and your nose with your navel Rest the tip of your tongue against the front of the roof of your mouth With teeth and lips together, both shut Always keep your eyes open and breathe softly through your nose Once you have adjusted your posture, take a breath and exhale fully Rock your body right and left and settle into steady and movable sitting Think of not thinking, not thinking What kind of thinking is that? Non-thinking, this is the essential art of zazen The zazen I speak of is not meditation practice It is simply the dharma gate of joyfully The practice realization of totally culminated enlightenment It is the koan realized, traps and snares can never reach it

[11:36]

If you grasp the point, you are like a dragon gaining the water Like a tiger taking to the mountains For you must know that the true dharma appears of itself So that from the start, dullness and distraction are struck aside When you arise from sitting, move slowly and quietly, calmly and deliberately Do not rise suddenly or abruptly In surveying the past, we find the transcendence of both mundane and sacred And dying while either sitting or standing Have all depended entirely on the power of zazen In addition, triggering awakening with a finger, a banner, a needle or a mallet And affecting realization with a whisk, a fist, a staff or a shelf These cannot be understood by discriminative effort Discriminative thinking, much less can they be known Through the practice of supernatural power They must represent conduct beyond seeing and hearing Are they not a standard prior to knowledge and views? This being the case, intelligence or lack of it is not an issue

[12:40]

Make no distinction between the dull and the sharp with it If you concentrate your effort single-mindedly That in itself is wholeheartedly engaging the way Practice realization is naturally undefiled Going forward is, after all, an everyday affair In general, in our world and others, in both India and China All equally hold the Buddha's feel While each lineage expresses its own style They are all typically devoted to sitting, totally blocked in resolute stability Why? Although they say that there are ten thousand distinctions and a thousand variations They all just wholeheartedly engage the way in zazen Why leave behind a seat in your own home to wander in vain Through the dusty realms of other lands? If you make one misstep you stumble past what is directly in front of you You have gained the pivotal opportunity of human form Do not pass your days and nights in vain You are taking care of the essential activity of the Buddha way

[13:43]

Who would take wasteful delight in the spark from a flintstone Besides form and substance their life would do on the grass The fortunes of life like a dart of lightning Emptied in an instant, vanished in a flash Please honor followers of Zen Long accustomed to groping for the elephant Do not doubt the true dragon Devote your energies to the way that points directly to the real thing Revere the one who has gone beyond and is free from effort Accord with the enlightenment of all the Buddhas Succeed to the samadhi of all the ancestors Continue to live in such a way and you will be such a person The treasure store will open up itself And you may enjoy it freely Thank you very much For those of you who worked on learning it by heart

[14:46]

did you find it to be a useful endeavor? Oh yeah I think by just chanting it every day I remember the first time I realized I knew the Heart Sutra by heart and I hadn't tried to memorize it and then there was the Dahi Shindhirani I couldn't believe that all those nonsense syllables without no meaning attached to them And so the capacity to learn things in that way is great for human beings, it's really great and we don't exercise it very much So I think you find when you know it by heart it comes out from you, the Dharma comes out from you when you need it, you know These phrases and words will be there, right? You can use it freely, you know So thank you all for making that effort to learn it by heart So this is our last class

[15:49]

and I was hoping we could talk about the phrase Think of not thinking For those of you who are here for the first time we've been going through this and the posture points the last couple of weeks talking about posture points pretty thoroughly and now we're at the point where it says Think of not thinking Not thinking? What kind of thinking is that? Non-thinking This is the essential art of Zazen You know I was concerned then there's a paragraph after that and the next paragraph talks about when you get up from sitting and I really didn't want to find that we were at the end of this evening's hour and a half without talking about how to get up from sitting So I thought we'd just spend a little bit of time about getting up from sitting and then back to the Think not thinking So on that second page When you arise from sitting

[16:50]

move slowly and quietly, calmly and deliberately Do not rise suddenly or abruptly So I just wanted to mention when you get up from sitting I think there are other traditions where the bell rings and people leap off of their cushions to do Kinyin and you may have practiced with groups that really get out of their posture fast and stand up right away But I just would like to recommend if you're not already doing it to actually it doesn't say rock your body right and left but the lineage coming through Suzuki Roshi was that when the bell rings you bow your hands open up on your legs and then you do the rocking first a little bit and then a little bit more and let the arc get wider and wider bigger and bigger until you stretch out and then carefully uncross your legs

[17:52]

make sure your feet aren't asleep pull up on your toes rub them a little bit if you need to and then swivel around clockwise and step down So in the in the Sochani Did we get the No, I just saw my note that says make copies Oh, okay I'm sorry Well, maybe we'll put those out later Sorry for those of you who We can send them maybe to people who are outside In that particular meditation text it talks about rubbing the body like rubbing yourself and the other meditation texts say the Changuang Jingwei when you come out of Samadhi move slowly and arise calmly do not be hasty or rough

[18:52]

after you have left Samadhi or concentration always employ appropriate means to protect and maintain the power of Samadhi as though you were protecting an infant So the emphasis is on you know not destroying your concentrated state of mind or state of mind and in the Ten Puku the early version of Fukanza Zangi he takes it pretty much from that when you arise from sitting move slowly and arise calmly do not be hasty or rough at all times protect and maintain the power of Samadhi but in the Fukanza Zangi that we chant and that's been studied he drops this thing about protecting and maintaining your Samadhi and just says when you arise from sitting move slowly and arise calmly do not be hasty or rough when you arise from sitting move slowly and quietly calmly and deliberately so so he dropped that thing about protecting the Samadhi which I find interesting and in the other two

[19:56]

meditation texts also it doesn't say anything about protecting your concentration practice which could be just part of the oral tradition that people understood that you know going from Zazen into Kinyin into walking meditation is it's continuing your Zazen practice into a walking moving meditation practice and I just wanted to mention that Kinyin is a wonderful practice that many people miss I've noticed in the morning and I think for many of us especially over 50 you know we actually have to go to the bathroom often but I also feel like some people use it as a break a little bit like well I think I'll I don't know what just kind of get out of here for a while and breathe a little fresh air and run around the cloud hall and then come back you know so I would highly recommend practicing Kinyin

[20:56]

the Zazen in action you know moving and this kind of slow walking especially during Sashin where you the effort to have an unbroken you know your day just flowing from Zazen to Kinyin to Zazen and to meals and break just one uninterrupted flow and I think you know if you need to use what we always say if you need to use the bathroom please go right ahead otherwise remain in the Zazen doing walking meditation so so carefully uncross carefully stand now are there any questions about that coming coming out of posture yes your point about Kinyin yes and people going I really experienced it as a kind of almost a flow of energy out of the Zazendo in some way I mean with all the people who go out

[21:57]

at first I found it really disconcerting but now you're used to it yeah well I think that's true it's like a mass exodus sometimes and I think guest students often are not are a little confused they thought they were supposed to stay there but everybody's leaving of course then there's people who go to work you know our Zazendo is such that many people have to go do a town trip go help in the kitchen or whatever go the guest program so there's a lot of reasons other than going to the bathroom also that people are leaving so basically you know eyes cast down is you don't have to see what else is happening in the room but just for yourself just just decide whether this is kinhin time or not for you but I just wanted to encourage you to practice kinhin kinhin is it means sutra walking and it's and I think it comes from

[22:57]

the sutras were like the word sutra comes from suture the same root as suture was sewing the palm leaves or whatever the writings were they were sewn together so the earliest ones those are the sutras right and sutra walking you actually it's like taking stitches you know these little half steps okay any other questions about arising from sitting yes I listened one time to you know a very advanced teacher giving sadhana instruction and saying when the bell rings you uncross your legs and wait for the feeling to come back and I thought well that kind of supposes that you know we expect that we won't have any feeling in our legs you know and so I kind of brought this up with her as a point like well you know I mean if there is something we can if there is a way

[23:59]

we can adjust our sitting so that we don't expect to lose feeling in our legs isn't that better you know and so I just wanted to I just wanted to hear you say that actually that that's not like standard or normal or yes or even a good idea to let you know to sit there you know legs falling asleep yeah the for some people especially in Burmese you know one leg in front of the other there is a tendency for the legs because of the pressure on the legs and that they fall asleep pretty easily some of you who sit in Burmese really expect actually that your legs will probably fall asleep I think the danger that's when your legs are in half or full lotus or in a chair or seiza they don't necessarily fall asleep as much as what I have noticed over the years and sometimes

[24:59]

just a little more height or moving your leg a little bit one way or another will alleviate that's falling asleep the danger in falling asleep can be if the pins and needles or the sleep numbness stays through or through rest period or through a break which may mean that there is some damage to the sciatic nerve which people have ruined themselves with sciatic nerve damage where they haven't been able to sit at all or have numbness in their legs all the time so it's really something to be very mindful of if your legs are falling asleep and they don't come back like just about as soon as you uncross and stand up but I as Rin said it's not necessarily that you should expect that they fall asleep I think there's ways to work with that with different cushion set ups and placing your legs different ways so yes I don't necessarily expect but I know some

[26:00]

people do experience that almost every time it seems to me that it really has very much to do with the nerve and the way it actually in your buttocks you know that where it comes from your spine it crosses your buttocks and skin and that sometimes just even a very slight alteration you know and experimenting with different configurations of cushions will you know I mean it's maybe a very minute change but it will make a big difference yes the sciatic nerve is about as thick as your thumb and it comes down the buttocks and down your leg and sometimes the xopho can really hit it right on the edge of that and yes I think something also if you have problems with that is to see if they're hyperextending because that will put pressure on them I took a couple people and they said yeah they were purposely pushing their lower back forward and I

[27:00]

think that's what was pressing down on them pressing down on them but as Ryn says cushion height cushion height and configuration yes also I switched to foam rod and it's much easier with sciatic also with sciatic sometimes if there's a big weight change like pregnancy or gaining weight or losing weight there's things like that that affect sciatic nerve and a cushion that's too hard too hard this is all part of the you know like talking about meditation or zazen like a sport you know like what are the best running shoes what's how to protect the knees so I think it's good to share these things with each other what's worked for you what hasn't okay should we go to think not thinking okay I want you to know I told Matt

[28:00]

when he came to walk me to class that I have been immersed in think not thinking how do you think not thinking non thinking for hours and I realized and Carol has a big thick chapter and I found all these other things about think not thinking so I I'll just bring forth my understanding of it at this point in my life and and we can talk about it so this particular section of the is different from the old version the first version and this is a kind of problematic thing for Soto Zen and I'll say why um so in the Chang Wan Ching Wei he says whenever this is after you've settled your posture and regulated your breath you should

[29:01]

relax your abdomen do not think of any good or evil whatsoever whenever a thought occurs be aware of it as soon as you are aware of it it will vanish if you remain for a long period forgetful of objects you will naturally become unified this is the essential art of So Cha Ni that's the first one then the Tem Pu Ku the first book on Zazengi that Dogen wrote the earliest version when he came back from China says once you have settled your posture you should regulate your breathing whenever a thought occurs be aware of it as soon as you are aware of it it will vanish if you remain for a long period forgetful of objects you will naturally become unified this is the essential art of Zazen Zazen is the Dharma gate of great ease and joy so it's almost word for word what Sun Tzu said in the So Cha Ni he pretty much lifted those very you know we talked about all this posture now it's what is the

[30:01]

practice of the mind you know how do you work with your thinking your mind and it's almost exactly then we go to the Fukan which came later which we are reciting and once you have regulated your posture take a breath and exhale fully swing the left and right sitting fixedly think of not thinking this is Carl's translation and we've been doing settle into steady immovable sitting how do you think of not thinking non-thinking this is the essential art of Zazen and then Zazen is not the practice of Jhana and the Shobo Genzo Zazen Shin is the same thing sitting fixedly think of not thinking how do you think of not thinking non-thinking this is the art of Zazen and the Bendo Ho same thing think of not thinking these were all later meditation

[31:01]

texts so when I say there's a kind of dilemma here for Soto Zen it's Dogen is supposedly transmitting the pure Dharma that came from his teacher Ru Jing straight from Shakyamuni Buddha all the way down to his own teacher and to him that he is now bringing to Japan so what is the first thing he writes he writes you know whenever a thought occurs be aware this is what he wrote pretty soon whenever a thought occurs be aware of it as soon as you're aware of it it will vanish if you remain forgetful of objects and then later he brings up this thing about think not thinking so does it mean I mean this is kind of a dilemma here that he didn't actually get think not thinking from Ru Jing why didn't he say that in the first place if that was what he was trying to transmit and if he didn't get it from Ru Jing and it's

[32:01]

his own what he's come to through his developing practice over time then is it the authentic Dharma come down from Shakyamuni Buddha to through his teacher so there's this problem for orthodox Soto Zen looking at Dogen's writing Linda Yes Does that mean that there is really this honest to goodness belief or I don't know if that's the right word but that all these teachings are I don't know exactly what body in general you're referring to but that all this stuff really is 100% all of it came directly from Buddha and it hasn't been changed and added to along the way I mean do people really think that that is well I think you know

[33:02]

the lineage itself that we chant you know that is you could say there were times in Zen history where they maybe fudged a little bit and sort of you know but what Dogen is actually saying and what he states over and over and over again is this is this practice that I'm teaching is the authentic transmitted practice that Shakyamuni Buddha did I mean he brings up it's the claim he's making and it's the claim you know this is where the historical the historian who looks at the material finds these things that over here that doesn't quite they couldn't have actually transmitted because they lived in different places or whatever so but the sort of religious I should say the orthodox teaching you know is that this even with

[34:04]

and I think you could say even with these the fact that the lineage isn't you can't actually prove that it went in that exact way I think you can see if you if you look at the teachers and go back to the sixth ancestor and to what Shakyamuni Buddha taught you can make a case definitely for this non-dual practice of sitting and that's and Dogen in particular is really stressing this now historically speaking that he is trying to bring this new teaching into Japan this was new and he really needs to make a case for this to for his new students who have come from other teachers and or who have left other practices and decided to go with him so he's very big on this yeah but there is but here we have this the fact that he wrote this earlier one and talked about forgetting of

[35:05]

objects so then the question is is think not thinking no different really from this earlier thing but it's just talking about it in a different way or interpreting it a different way or but the actuality of it is the practice is just the same so these are the questions that become um are brought into relief you know by studying these two looking at these two together um so the think not thinking this comes from a koan and the koan is yakusan igen is sitting zazen and let me read it from um it's in um the fascicle called zazen shin and zazen shin shin in this case

[36:05]

um is a needle like an acupuncture needle it's sometimes translated as a lancet and it's it's a needle that like an acupuncture that is used for healing so it became used this this particular it's shin it's different than the mind heart shin it's a different character this shin is used for teachings that are like short teachings like maxims that's another translation of it that are used to help people for um to point to something to um heal body and mind so this is zazen shin or and it's a needle for zazen but it's kind of a funny translation unless you think of acupuncture needle you wouldn't necessarily a needle doesn't carry that in the west so I'm not sure it's more and more it is but so in zazen shin it starts out while great master yakusan is sitting a monk asks him what are you thinking in the

[37:06]

still still state now this translation of still still state is gotsu gotsu chi what are you thinking sitting there in gotsu gotsu chi and gotsu is the character it's it's repeated for emphasis gotsu is a character for a table like mountain so and and it it means um lofty steady kind of like a mountain so what are you doing there sitting there in this steady stillness like a mountain gotsu gotsu chi and they translate it here as still still state or mountain still sitting and another translation of it is um no no did I do it again here it is yes while yakusan was sitting

[38:06]

a monk asked what's sitting in gotsu gotsu chi gotsu gotsu chi um is like immovable sitting tough sitting steadfast steady like a mountain so so yakusan sitting there you can picture this person sitting in zazen a person this is a koan about zazen itself so um what are you thinking in zazen what are you thinking in this gotsu gotsu chi in this steady immovable mountain like stillness and the master says this translation is thinking the concrete state of not thinking and our translation is think not thinking and this one is uh the monk asked what's thinking in gotsu gotsu chi and the master said think not thinking now in japanese

[39:07]

thinking is shiryo s-h-i-r-y-o shiryo and not thinking or thinking not of not thinking is fu shiryo and then non thinking is hi shiryo so it's this shiryo fu shiryo and hi shiryo are these all these thinking and not thinking in the unthinkable fu and chi yes yeah um I'm not let's see the fu is the not thinking or the unthinkable and the hi I don't know exactly what the character means it's it's non non thinking or beyond thinking is another translation for hi shiryo either beyond thinking or non thinking now you might

[40:08]

feel like you know it's all it's like what are we talking about here what is this non thinking thinking unthinkable think of the thing it's it's just like a big mess it sounds like a big mess and I I just want to read this to you this um dogen this is dogen so I'll just read it you can just just absorb it as so yes how can the state so after um he says what are you thinking in the still still state or what are you thinking in goto goto the master says thinking the concrete state of not thinking basically thinking of not thinking or thinking the unthinkable the monk says how can the state of not thinking be thought and the master says it is non thinking and then dogen goes on experiencing the state in which the words of the great master are like this we should learn in practice mountain still sitting and we should receive the authentic transmission

[41:09]

of mountain still sitting this is the investigation of mountain still sitting which has been transmitted in buddhism thinking in the still still state is not of only one kind but yakusan's words are one example of it these words are thinking the concrete state of not thinking they include thinking as skin flesh bones and marrow and not thinking as skin flesh bones and marrow the monk says how can the state of not thinking be thought truly although the state of not thinking is ancient still it is how can it be thought about and it goes on in the still still state how could it be impossible for thinking to exist and so forth so i want to try and um look together at what these terms are looking at it is it is it really that far out is it really like i give up

[42:09]

i don't even want to think about this anymore or is it something we can um um in some that is not so foreign so so as as i said um one of these classes that there is nothing hidden in the first in the first thousand instruction that were given were told everything you know and this non thinking or beyond thinking includes can include both our thinking mind and thinking or or not thinking mind it includes both it's beyond thinking so what is beyond thinking and in thousand instruction one thing that um is said is after all the posture points then it's sit there and if a thought arises just let it pass through just let it go like a

[43:10]

bird flying through the sky maybe some you can just remember back here is asan instruction like a bird or a cloud you know rises up and it kind of floats along makes a shape and then it goes it arises moves through and this is you can't say that this is thinking because the usual way we use the word thinking is that we make an effort to put our mind to something to pursue it to reflect on it to turn it to add to it to elaborate to um get involved with it this is this is thinking how we usually understand thinking so it's awesome this kind of the cloud image at the cloud moving across your mind as a thought if you let it be and don't pursue it as Suzuki Roshi says don't invite it into tea don't elaborate don't um

[44:11]

get involved with externals get involved and pursue it and add and add and add until that's non-thinking okay it's a thought yes it is a thought but what else is it and yet it's not thinking it's not Shirio and our usual way of thinking but it's not not thinking it's not some blank getting rid of thoughts you know how also in the first day of Zazen instruction here said don't try to push the thoughts away don't try to make a blank state of mind or or um if a thought arises you note it it goes through and you and it goes away now this is sort of reminiscent of you know that it vanishes you know objects um be aware of it and as soon as you're aware of it it vanishes you know so is this is think not thinking kind of another way of talking about

[45:12]

objects that vanish you know if you if you're aware of them and they vanish we don't know exactly but this is you can ponder that yourself so so a mistake that often we have is that our effort is supposed to be to get rid of thoughts somehow right to and often because thoughts may be disturbing painful mentally emotionally painful or physical things are happening and sensations are happening and and you can't stand it and it's a kind of so when you're sitting our effort is not to do anything you know to cast all cast aside all involvements cease all affairs you know do not think good or bad it's just alert steady sitting in like a mountain aware alert steadfast mountain sitting and

[46:13]

then just like as she says your stomach is constantly digesting and secreting and all the rest of your body is producing whatever it produces hormones and lymph and bile and just you're alive you know you're alive and the brain is also producing thoughts will produce thoughts a bird will bird will sing frogs will croak a thought will come trying to make yourself any different than that so what is it like to sit and go to go to chi what are you thinking and go to go to chi thinking of not thinking how or thinking the unthinkable how do you think the unthinkable non-thinking or beyond thinking so I for me I think it's important to feel like this is not

[47:13]

so exotic this is not dog and trying to pull the wool over eyes or something or make it very esoteric and this mystical far-out thing I actually feel like he wants people to sit and realize their true nature and he feels us and I mean he you know is the the entrance gate this body practice and he's I think talking very directly about it but as as Karl Bielfeldt says the kind of beauty of dog and is that he can say it he can have chapters about it and fascicles and talk over and over and over without us feeling like it's been revealed or like it's like we can't get we can't get a hold of it you can't grasp it in the way we usually grasp concepts or oh yeah I get it you know sure I get it it's it's the getting it or the

[48:13]

understanding of it has to be realized through sitting and the more you which I've been doing for the last week the more you try to get it through kind of grasp it with the mind it evades you know you can't grasp hold of it in that way so as a meditation instruction though we are actually on the very first day we're offered this very simple practice which we don't understand I certainly didn't I thought I told you that the instructor didn't know what he was talking about it's got to be more than that it's so so this mind that neither and we also talk about neither pushes things away trying to get rid of which is hate or holds on and grasps

[49:13]

and attaches to which is greed and is not confused which is the delusion so the mind that neither grasps or pushes away what kind of mind is that what kind of mind is that and that's a mind that has is let go is let go of grasping is let go of pushing away is just steady alert and sitting go to go to cheat but but aren't we in the in the very act of using this metaphor grasping I mean just the apprehension of mind yeah this this picture that you know things just coming up and you don't touch them you just let them float away like clouds on a sunny day I mean isn't

[50:14]

this metaphor an attempt to grasp what is ungraspable well yes this is a concept this is a story this is an instruction that's been given to help one to realize the inconceivable so we give each other these concepts you know because we operate in these words but Dogan is you know we're also you know we're not supposed to rely on words and you know what does he say about don't chase after phrases and so forth so it it it can't be realized through the grasping of those words or those stories or those instructions even it has to be realized through but but that's the thing that's like when I mentioned about that first koan in the Shouyo Roku where the world honored one

[51:14]

ascends the seat for the Dharma talk right and he just sits there doesn't say anything right and Manjushri hits the gavel the Dharma of the Dharma King is thus right there is nothing to say right there is and yet through the great compassion of our Buddhas and ancestors they left us words that we are not to rely on or chase after but will encourage us yeah I mean how can we be certain that this this kind of metaphor that we that we begin is what Dilgan was talking about I mean in some way historically over the years this kind of metaphor being attached to Dilgan's thoughts you mean of the clouds and the letting

[52:16]

things go I can't cite it right now I think I'm trying to think of Suzuki Roshi if he uses clouds or birds I think Suzuki Roshi used birds flying across so I think there are you can find Zen masters who use this these kinds of metaphors yeah Lisa I like the translation of thinking the unthinkable and one of the things I've done in Zazen is rather than focus on the content of my thought I've started to look at the belief that there's somebody solid thinking that thought and what's interesting is that all thought seems to have that the basis of all thought seems to be about a solid thinker the belief of a solid thinker that you know I can sit

[53:17]

and think about my day and I can sit and think about last week and I can sit and think about what somebody said to me or what I should have done and it's all around somebody solid and yet moment by moment there's no solid person there's no there's not necessarily continuity of self at least in a sense of thinker and so I think about thinking the unthinkable that's what comes up for me so that's a state of non-thinking I think you know that this practice this is we're talking about practice and when when you see just like Lisa said that the thoughts themselves whatever the content is they all have the same quality you know they all are usually we identify so strongly with the content the content side of it that we're not paying attention to the causes and conditions or the the cloud

[54:22]

like quality of how the thoughts arise and vanish this arising and vanishing because we we begin thinking of the what it is you know and and what she said to me and da da da but if you this is the turning the light back as well if you look at the mind that thinks the um the thoughts themselves all that's why it's like do not think good or bad do not gauge right and wrong because they all are empty of you know they all have the same quality it's not that we don't perceive of you know likes and dislikes and those kinds of things but the like and the dislike are equal in their emptiness are equal in that same quality of conditioned

[55:22]

co-production of dependently co-arisen quality of them so we usually get caught in the content and this practice of allowing the thoughts this I I find it very helpful this digestive you know like brain secretions these thoughts that they're in Zazen to just allow them to be secreted without this grabbing on and we wake up in Zazen to the quality of the thoughts themselves you you have a I feel like I'm really straining my voice here talking about the unthinkable um anyway sitting in Gotsu Gotsu Chi you have a opportunity to uh

[56:22]

realize the insubstantiality of thoughts rather than we usually think of them as very solid and and also this insubstantiality of the five skandhas yes it also makes me think of how they say the Buddha used to say what I teach goes against the stream so that um I mean I think of it as deconstruction it's not like you can make it happen but to not think on top thinking is to go against what you would normally do ordinarily and so to turn like you said turn the light back is also going against our tendency that's right deconstructing that tendency yes because our habitual way of thinking is a thought comes and you pursue it you go after it you get to the bottom of it you um

[57:25]

uh you know it's this whole mechanism of our intellectual thinking mind what analyze yes analyzing but this is kind of my question yes this is my burning issue yes so what happens if you have this thought passing by like a cloud I should be trying to get rid of that and when I say I want to get this closer I should just say okay let that go and then but the next thought will be

[58:27]

but I want to look at this you know I want to think about it I want to get involved in it but then other people seems like I've been told well that's just what's happening in your mind just watch it so I get very confused yes yes um I can't say strongly enough how much I um do not want to give the impression of getting rid of anything you know so so the the this thing of um I think this is the pitfall of even talking about this is we begin to think oh I was supposed to get rid of these they come up and I got to get them out you know and then and that thought that second thought of I want to really look at this no no I can't I got to get it out of here you know I think actually the practice

[59:27]

of sitting and go to go to chi um uh is a kind of there's some space there there's some spaciousness there that um and and also I should say sometimes in Zazen there is something we are preoccupied meaning we are even before we sit down we are occupied like an occupational army that is there like yeah like an army that's coming and is occupying and you cannot find um um there's no space you you're just taken up with some crisis kind of thing or something that is just so so you sit with that you sit with troubled body and mind or you sit with preoccupation and you give space to that but it but also that isn't still

[60:28]

the effort is especially with your body it's body the body practice is so important which is why we spent so much time on the posture things first because you're sitting in this way as best as possible to give yourself the um the most um um um to help yourself to help yourself through your body practice and and you know I know that Suzuki Roshi wants six a little notebook into zazen with them to jot things down because they were so troubled by these thoughts and they couldn't sit so okay just write it down you can think of it later you know so this this is the quality of our zazen sometime but I I really want to emphasize that just your effort to

[61:28]

sit with troubled body and mind with preoccupation with obsession um is that's alright you know that's just it's to not worry too much actually about what the content is to not it the the effort to just sit there and this is because practice realization are totally undefiled so just you're taking the posture just you're sitting there is practice realization the faith or the the practice is based on enlightenment right now it does to not be so terribly concerned to have some faith that you just sit and this is realizing your practice yes ma'am just before you said the word faith I was thinking it must take like some kind of faith to um to sit there and because there's this natural tendency to wanna think on top of thinking and I was just trying to imagine what if you did that with everything like you thought

[62:29]

that was the way to um if you would never turn the light I mean there would just be an endless you would you'd have to have a lot of time on your hands to try to figure it out in that way by thinking and it's just impossible but there's just this feeling of um well I have to think about it you know but I think it takes faith to just sort of let it go um let them come up and go it's amazing how great it can be and how things can just cycle through in and out and yeah I think it takes a lot of faith to just um not really get involved with things on a level on a certain level where you're aware of what's going on and and some kind of um conscious way I was thinking about when you're in a when you're in a play and you're you're learning your part and you're completely focused on what you have to say next

[63:29]

and what the other person is going to say to you and you know how your face is going to look and it's just this complete focus on content and on what's going on and what's being talked about and it's so focused on having to sort of say your lines and what if you miss it and there's not the um obsession with what's going on and um Was there another hand that I missed somewhere? No. Julia? Yeah, two things. It seems to me that learning how to sit like a mountain, it gives us a home to come back to, you know, when our mind is flying off. That cultivating that mountain-like stability gives us that home to come back to. The other thing is, I love those metaphors, you know, of weather and clouds and birds and everything but sometimes they're not sufficient so I've made up another metaphor

[64:30]

for myself and that is a closet full of toys and I'm sitting in an empty room full of sunlight, maybe on a Zapp room, completely empty white room full of sunlight and there's a closet full of toys and those toys are my fantasies and my stories that I love to play with and so I know that they're toys and every once in a while I say okay, you can take a toy out now and I play with it for a little while and I put it back in and somehow if I'm getting really bored, you know, I just have this little toy cupboard but if I know it's a toy cupboard and I'm taking it out and I'm going to put it back in then it helps. Thank you. Toys R Us? I hope I'm not, what's the word, defiling the way by coming up with this instruction. Toys R Us.

[65:32]

Toys R Us. Yes. I've been sort of curious about this, that this instruction is actually my past and want to be frightened and I do think of not thinking, do not think and I wonder, you know, sometimes I, I mean, there's an anxiety there and I know that's true or how it's addressed. Oh, that's interesting. Does anyone feel like it's, well, you don't have to put, think in yourself whether you think that's a scary thing but I know how I felt about it. It's like, I love the Fukunsen Zangi but I kind of like to skip that part, you know, when I was learning it. I mean, I know it's like really focused on a lot of this thinking but I didn't know what they were talking about so I like more, you know, eat and drink moderately and loosen your belt, you know, something that, something very concrete. But, it's really, it's not about trying to make yourself into a automaton with some blank mind who's just sitting there like a kind of, you know, scary phantom-like

[66:33]

being, you know, it's more, it's pointing to a kind of free, you know, he says right after that, what does he say? Joyful ease. That's, is this right? Yeah, so, the Zazen I speak of is not meditation practice, you know, all these things we were talking about last week, all these specific things, it is simply the Dharmagate of joyful ease. So, I think he right away maybe is anticipating that somebody might feel like, yikes, I don't want to do, yes, joyful ease, the practice realization of totally culminating in light, and then, it is the koan realized, traps and snares can never reach it, it's like, you're not, you can't be caught by the stories and the, you're free, you know, it's really, and then these animals,

[67:33]

if you grasp the point, you're like, let's see, a dragon lives in water, right? So it's like this dragon gaining the water, you can see dragons fly, you know, over the ocean, and then it goes, you can just hear it hissing as it goes into the water back home, you know, back to its element, and the tiger or the mountain lion taking to the mountains, you know, back to their home where they're free, where they know the, everything, it's their home, it's like that, that's, that's what, yes. Well, when, when he mentions fear, it makes me think of, you know, we're so attached to those stories, and we so identify with them, that there may be this feeling, well, but who am I without that story? You know, and so when there's that sense of gaining, or entering that empty space, of pulling back and clinging to those stories that tell me who I am. Yes, yes. When Steve Weintraub

[68:35]

first started practicing and heard about this, um, no self and all this, this song came up in his mind, which was no, no, they can't take that away from you. That was his theme song during those early years. No, no, they can't. So, yes, exactly like that. And I think that emptiness teaching, um, and teaching of non-self is destabilizing for people, and, and we have to be very careful when we bring up these kinds of teachings because people, I remember in a, in a introduction to Buddhism class, kind of a survey, um, and we were talking about emptiness and this person, you mean, you know, that there's no self, it was like she was visibly upset and, and in the sutras it says if a bodhisattva hears these teachings and is not cowed and is not frightened and is not shaking, then they're bodhisattva, you know, it's, so,

[69:35]

um, yes, I think there is, people misunderstand and, um, can have some reaction with that, yeah. It strikes me that, um, for example, you want to hear all about the body, I mean, and how it feels and adjusting your bones and things like that, but for me, this was much more interesting and I just sort of like this right away, yeah, I loved it, I loved it and I, kind of like koan study and I think depending upon what your character structure is and depending upon your imprinting from day one in life, it's just a different game, so, for me, the think, not thinking, at some point early in my practice, I got that right away, but I spent my whole life dealing mentally in concepts, so, it was fun, it was like candy,

[70:37]

oh, oh, this is the mind, this is what the mind does, like, you know, the hand does this, this is the way the mind plays, and so, for me, it was the field of play, but I think, you know, we all have a different maybe gate through which we enter. That is so helpful, you know, I, my psychological type in terms of Mayor Briggs tests, you know, is sensate, so, this is what I find all the time, it's like, are you familiar with those, let's see, what are they, oh, I actually can't remember what they are, oh, introvert, sensate, intuitive, and thinking, feeling, so, my, those are different functions, you know, and everyone has a strong suit, you know, so, my strong suit supposedly is sensate, which is exactly what Grace says, it's like, you know, the tongue above and the ears in line and all those things,

[71:38]

they speak to me in a very strong way, I kind of get it through the body, you know, and somebody else whose thinking function is, so, so, yes, I think there's different gates, different worlds, really, yeah. Martha, you had your hand up? Yeah, it seems as if he is speaking about Buddha's mind here, which seems so different from our ordinary everyday, and it's, for me it's hard not to make Buddha's mind into some grand ideal, you know. You think he's talking about Buddha's mind and not, and not your mind? No, I think he's speaking about my mind. Uh-huh. Uh-huh. I think we do make it into an ideal, though, like this, like we can never reach it, it's not for me, he couldn't be talking to me, I'm just slogging along here, my knees hurt, you know, and that's it. Yeah.

[72:42]

I also was thinking of how when I began sitting I felt like I was making this commitment to, you know, let some of my, uh, when I was sitting to let certain things just drop. I would tell myself, you can always pick them up later, and then I couldn't think of a good reason to pick certain ones up again. Yeah, yeah. We do end up feeling like we're carrying all this baggage, you know, and at a certain point it's like, this is so heavy, you know, just boom. Yeah. Or we're kind of carrying, this is like, it's dogma, but carrying ourself forward all the time, carrying ourself forward, oh, it's so exhausting. And then you actually realize I could just leave it. Um, how are we doing here? Is it 10-2? 10-2. Um, I want to just look at my notes here for a second. Um, so, what we have

[73:42]

been talking about in terms of echo head show, we're turning the light back, it's cease the involvements, you know, cease getting involved externally and no coughing or sighing in the mind. Those, those two meditation instructions is, I think they dovetail with think not thinking in terms of, um, think the unthinkable. The unthinkable is, it's inconceivable, what is this not getting involved and not coughing and sighing, what is that? And, you know, the monk in this story said, how, how is it sitting in gotsu gotsu chi? And Dogen takes these questions of, you know, he uses words like what and how as sort of turning phrases or, or ways of getting deeper into what the words are actually pointing to. let's see if I can, um, well,

[74:43]

as usual, anyway, to, to ask, um, what, what is think, thinking the unthinkable, what, rather than that being a question, you know how you can play with this? To, to say, what is thinking the unthinkable? The mind of what? The mind of what is the mind that's not knowing. The mind that's just what? Which is alert, ready, pliant, flexible, alive. Sitting in gotsu gotsu chi is the mind of what? So, what is thinking the unthinkable? What is non-thinking? The mind of what? Which is beginner's mind,

[75:45]

rather than the mind that, the mind of I know it all, I've got it all, I got it all taken care of here, folks. That's the mind, Suzuki Roshi talks, the mind, the expert's mind, right? Who's, where there's not very much, um, possibilities anymore, because they're all, they got it all taken care of. So, someone was talking with me about this phrase, not knowing is nearest, or not knowing is most intimate, which is the mind of what? Which is, this is gotsu gotsu chi, also, but doesn't depend on sitting cross-legged, and I think that's what he's talking, that's why this zazen is not learning meditation, because it isn't just sitting zazen, it's, it's more the mind of what? Thinking of wonderful, wonder-ful, you know, that often comes up,

[76:47]

that's what wonderful means, it's full of wonder, it's full of what, just ready. Yes. Yeah. The joyful, you know, ease. Was that your hand raised, Grace? No. No. So, we only have a few minutes, just kind of, this next paragraph, where in addition, the triggering awakening, right before, we find that transcendence of both mundane and sacred, and dying, while either sitting or standing, have all depended entirely on the power of zazen, and I just wanted to say, you know, Dogen, zazen is like the center crown jewel, you know, this is what, through everything he writes, it's zazen, this is what he's offering, but to not

[77:51]

narrow it to, you know, I have to be able to sit full lotus, and, you know, that's a kind of getting rid of, or a kind of harshness, or doing damage to yourself, it's this wide coming home, and this sitting posture is the, the gate and the entrance, and, dying, you know, actually, there's stories of zen masters who, at the last, they get themselves somehow into zazen posture, and die while sitting, and, there's a story that I have in my notes from Rev's class about a zen master who could never sit full lotus, but at the end, when he was, did I tell you this story? Right before he was dying, he broke his legs to put them into full lotus, so he could die sitting full lotus, which, I don't know how that affects you

[78:52]

exactly, but, It doesn't sound a little right. There's something that, it hits me very deeply, but Suzuki Roshi, when he was dying, and maybe you know this story, he was very sick, and couldn't get into zazen posture, but it was the first day of a sashin, and he said to the people at his deathbed, I think it was Zentatsu Myoyu, his disciple, he said, I can't sit cross-legged, but you all will do that for me. Everyone's sitting zazen for me. So this, this, love of zazen, and protecting, and devotion too, totally devoted, you know, in this world, and other worlds, both in India and China, all equally hold the Buddha seal, even though there's ten thousand distinctions,

[79:53]

and a thousand, they all just wholeheartedly engage the way in zazen. So this is, I really feel this is Dogen's what he puts forward over and over and over. And we have a sashin coming up, so we'll be, you know, getting to practice a full week together. What was that, Greg? We'll all be wholeheartedly engaging. Wholeheartedly engaging in a mobile sitting. Yeah. What? They can sit it for me too. Okay, yes. So, are there any other parts that we haven't covered that you've kind of been wondering about or wanted to say something about, or these last paragraphs

[80:55]

kind of leaping ahead here, but... Oh, I know what I wanted to say. This finger mallet, you know, whisk and shout, and these are all... I was trying to look up all the koans that Dogen is citing with these, but the finger is Ju, Di, one finger, Zen, you know, whenever anybody asked this teacher about anything, about zazen, he would hold up one finger, and people were enlightened by that. And so his disciple thought, Oh, this is a pretty good... Yeah, I'll try that. You know, so his teacher asked him something and he held up his finger and his teacher... I think his teacher cut his finger off. Yes? And he was enlightened. You know, so... These are these stories that you don't want to try it on your friends. Don't try it on your friends. And then there's a number of koans

[81:56]

where they shake their staff or they, you know, pound the staff, and there's... Isn't there a banner in Ananda's? Yes, Ananda, take down the banner. Yes, that was Ananda's story. What did the Buddha give you that he didn't give me? Right. More than the Roman bowl, did he give you anything else? And then he said, Ananda, take down the banner pole. They used to put a banner up when you're going to debate with another teacher, and he said, take down the banner pole, which, well, I don't want to explain it, but to me, it had to do with the non-separateness of Ananda and Makakasho. A needle, I don't know what the... Does anyone know what the needle is? On water, yeah. I don't know which koan. And, you know, there's a number of koans

[82:56]

where people shout. In fact, I think Baso shouted so loud that Nangaka was deaf for three days and was enlightened. They all have a good ending. So that's... And these are... This is activity. This is awakened activity. This is... This is enlightened activity. This is not... I mean, I was in a situation in a group where someone read these stories and somebody was bothering them and they took them by the collar and they shook them around, you know, and the poor person thought she was being assaulted and I had to meet with them. We had to have a whole reconciliation thing. But he actually thought, well, it was just like the stories. He was... So these are... These stories are the expressions of enlightened beings who, you know,

[83:58]

understand... Yeah, right. Yeah, watch out for the hot. Okay. It's nine o'clock and time to end. Thank you very, very much. I really appreciated working together and studying this together. And... And there's... And it's endless. It's endless, so... Thank you. Thank you. Thanks. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.

[84:42]

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